NASA Engineering - A Troubling Perspective
I had the unique pleasure of having a discussion with a NASA electrical and mechanical engineer from the Glenn Research Center last night. He is a friend of my dad's and came over for our cookout/football party the past couple of days. This is all true to the best of my recollection and I am writing this post specifically because I have heard of this in the past but for it to be happening all the time at NASA it shows America has a big problem with education. There are students in this country that have achieved high education but can't function in the real world.
Most of the time when people talk about "Education in America" and the problems we are having the perspective is always on inner-city school districts, a lack of English-speaking students, bad test scores, students not having any motivation, and the list goes on and on and on. What you don't hear about is the other end - the high end problems we are having with education in America. In fact, I bet most of you have never heard of there being a problem with higher level education in America - but you probably know about the issues I am about to outline.
When I was talking to my engineering instructor in the past couple years at the high school I went to he outlined this problem (I spent my Junior and Senior years, '02-'04, in high school in Engineering Technology). They are getting some very intelligent people in there that are taking the high level math courses and have very high grade point averages. This is a good thing - to a point. Most of those people, and the "best performers" of the batch, have NO HANDS-ON, MECHANICAL COMMON SENSE! They can crunch out elaborate calculus equations in their heads but they can't turn a damn screw driver to build something.
Apparently the cause for this is the school district is pushing for higher performance students to be placed in the engineering program. This SHOULD make sense, but follow me with this one - it DOESN'T!!!!
The conversation I had with this engineer last night was one of the most mind-bogglingly interesting conversations I have ever had. He comes from a Marine Corps background. As we started in to our conversation the first topic was about oil-less bearings that use airfoils to suspend high-RPM shafts. Some aircraft engines are using the technology right now to increase the power to weight ratio (no oil = no oil weight).
As we were meandering through our topics one that came up and really hooked me was that this engineer works with interns all the time. They have three "waves" of interns each year and the research they do has to fall between the internship programs as much as possible because of the secret nature of some of the research, which keeps them delaying projects.
One intern in particular that this guy has worked with for the past three summers is a very intelligent person working on a Masters degree in Mechanical Engineering, and getting to that point in 4 years. For a perspective, I am in my last quarter - an additional one after having completed 5 years already in college (albeit, after playing ping-pong with a few programs) to complete a BS in Technology Education (non-teaching) and a Minor in Agricultural Systems Management. Getting in to a masters program in less than 4 years for Mechanical Engineering is phenomenal.
This intern apparently had no common sense, no social skills, and did not know how to function when told to wait before getting assistance from the engineers. The projects the research engineers work on take precedence over the interns so they have to get done. Telling this particular intern to go do something else and wait didn't work - he would stand there and literally watch over the research engineers "waiting" for them to finish so he could get help on his "project".
For being a very paper-smart person the guy didn't have the ability to re-direct his brain to something else. The problem he had would overwhelm him and he had to get it worked out "now".
In another example, an intern that was working in the shop was asked to machine a part on a mill - a manual mill. For being a very book-smart person the intern had no hands-on experience in a shop. After being instructed on what to do, the engineer I spoke with last night said he went back later to check up on the intern and found that several of HIS end mills (the tool that cuts on a mill, like a drill bit but much fancier) had been shattered. This was because the intern didn't follow procedure in machining the part. The part was made out of aluminum and the intern ran the mill too hard. The chips glued themselves to the mill, clogging it. The mill was then pulled out, BANGED ON THE TABLE TO GET THE CHIPS OUT, and then shattered in the process.
Where in the world does NASA find these people? Do they scan universities looking for the best of the best? I wonder how they classify the best of the best.
The engineer I spoke with did not have a clue how these people got in there - and he was the one that was stuck working with them. Bouncing between all the projects he is assigned to and managing and then getting thrown interns that, for all intents and purposes, have no business being in a shop with their apparent skill set is retarded. Of course, not everyone falls in this scenario, but a large number of them do - most of the interns that the guy I spoke with has worked with in the past did, and do.
I really can't explain in words on this post how energized and pissed off I got in this conversation.
My problem, and I think America's problem, with higher level education is you are making smart people, yes, but because of their intelligence they don't have the mechanical hands-on skills, people skills, and just plain old common sense that is required in the real world!!!
We can educate people all we want, but higher level education isn't going to teach people the real-world hands-on skills that companies need - and hearing this play out like I did from a NASA research engineer just about made me jump out of my skin.
Here is a company, organization, whatever you want to call it (government agency?) that I would absolutely SHINE in. I have had an entire year's worth of AutoCAD and Inventor programming courses in college, plus an additional two years that I got in the high school engineering program, I have a quarter of manual machining, a quarter of CAM (computer aided machining - getting in to CNC programming and all), I have an Extra class ham radio license and the electronics background to go with it; I have the building skills and the designing skills that a place like this would go bananas for. What I DON'T have is the engineering background. I don't have the math background. I don't have the "intelligence" that NASA would require for me to have on PAPER to have even a chance at getting in.
Can you see my frustration? Can you see the thermometer on my head about to blow like an atomic bomb?
There are people in this world that have FANTASTIC skill sets, some skill sets that you can never teach to someone - they have to be acquired through self motivation. Yet the people that would fit in with the work that some companies (and government agencies) do can not make it in because they don't have the credentials on paper - the math and engineering skills.
I am not saying I want to go work for NASA. I already have a career lined up somewhere else after I graduate so I won't be investigating this opportunity, however difficult it would be for me, not having the "paper knowledge", to worm my way in in the first place. However, after speaking with this engineer I would fit in so well with that company. Yet, I am not speaking for myself - I am speaking for the thousands of students out there that are in the SAME BOAT I AM that can't step in to a fantastic career because of their lack of paper knowledge.
This is just such a mind boggling problem - America wants us to be higher educated. Companies are after the best of the best. They only want to look at the graduates in the top 10% of their programs for recruitment. Schools are telling students to push harder and achieve greater.
What about the common sense? What about the hands-on skills? What about the people skills? Who is going to teach these? How are students going to learn them and do well with them?
If these are the budding engineers going to work for NASA we in America have a problem. I hope none of them work on any projects involving sending people to the Moon or Mars, or anywhere else in space, or on Earth for that matter, because they don't have the brain capacity (its all filled with numbers and theory) to hold common sense, hands-on skills, and people skills.
Most of the time when people talk about "Education in America" and the problems we are having the perspective is always on inner-city school districts, a lack of English-speaking students, bad test scores, students not having any motivation, and the list goes on and on and on. What you don't hear about is the other end - the high end problems we are having with education in America. In fact, I bet most of you have never heard of there being a problem with higher level education in America - but you probably know about the issues I am about to outline.
When I was talking to my engineering instructor in the past couple years at the high school I went to he outlined this problem (I spent my Junior and Senior years, '02-'04, in high school in Engineering Technology). They are getting some very intelligent people in there that are taking the high level math courses and have very high grade point averages. This is a good thing - to a point. Most of those people, and the "best performers" of the batch, have NO HANDS-ON, MECHANICAL COMMON SENSE! They can crunch out elaborate calculus equations in their heads but they can't turn a damn screw driver to build something.
Apparently the cause for this is the school district is pushing for higher performance students to be placed in the engineering program. This SHOULD make sense, but follow me with this one - it DOESN'T!!!!
The conversation I had with this engineer last night was one of the most mind-bogglingly interesting conversations I have ever had. He comes from a Marine Corps background. As we started in to our conversation the first topic was about oil-less bearings that use airfoils to suspend high-RPM shafts. Some aircraft engines are using the technology right now to increase the power to weight ratio (no oil = no oil weight).
As we were meandering through our topics one that came up and really hooked me was that this engineer works with interns all the time. They have three "waves" of interns each year and the research they do has to fall between the internship programs as much as possible because of the secret nature of some of the research, which keeps them delaying projects.
One intern in particular that this guy has worked with for the past three summers is a very intelligent person working on a Masters degree in Mechanical Engineering, and getting to that point in 4 years. For a perspective, I am in my last quarter - an additional one after having completed 5 years already in college (albeit, after playing ping-pong with a few programs) to complete a BS in Technology Education (non-teaching) and a Minor in Agricultural Systems Management. Getting in to a masters program in less than 4 years for Mechanical Engineering is phenomenal.
This intern apparently had no common sense, no social skills, and did not know how to function when told to wait before getting assistance from the engineers. The projects the research engineers work on take precedence over the interns so they have to get done. Telling this particular intern to go do something else and wait didn't work - he would stand there and literally watch over the research engineers "waiting" for them to finish so he could get help on his "project".
For being a very paper-smart person the guy didn't have the ability to re-direct his brain to something else. The problem he had would overwhelm him and he had to get it worked out "now".
In another example, an intern that was working in the shop was asked to machine a part on a mill - a manual mill. For being a very book-smart person the intern had no hands-on experience in a shop. After being instructed on what to do, the engineer I spoke with last night said he went back later to check up on the intern and found that several of HIS end mills (the tool that cuts on a mill, like a drill bit but much fancier) had been shattered. This was because the intern didn't follow procedure in machining the part. The part was made out of aluminum and the intern ran the mill too hard. The chips glued themselves to the mill, clogging it. The mill was then pulled out, BANGED ON THE TABLE TO GET THE CHIPS OUT, and then shattered in the process.
Where in the world does NASA find these people? Do they scan universities looking for the best of the best? I wonder how they classify the best of the best.
The engineer I spoke with did not have a clue how these people got in there - and he was the one that was stuck working with them. Bouncing between all the projects he is assigned to and managing and then getting thrown interns that, for all intents and purposes, have no business being in a shop with their apparent skill set is retarded. Of course, not everyone falls in this scenario, but a large number of them do - most of the interns that the guy I spoke with has worked with in the past did, and do.
I really can't explain in words on this post how energized and pissed off I got in this conversation.
My problem, and I think America's problem, with higher level education is you are making smart people, yes, but because of their intelligence they don't have the mechanical hands-on skills, people skills, and just plain old common sense that is required in the real world!!!
We can educate people all we want, but higher level education isn't going to teach people the real-world hands-on skills that companies need - and hearing this play out like I did from a NASA research engineer just about made me jump out of my skin.
Here is a company, organization, whatever you want to call it (government agency?) that I would absolutely SHINE in. I have had an entire year's worth of AutoCAD and Inventor programming courses in college, plus an additional two years that I got in the high school engineering program, I have a quarter of manual machining, a quarter of CAM (computer aided machining - getting in to CNC programming and all), I have an Extra class ham radio license and the electronics background to go with it; I have the building skills and the designing skills that a place like this would go bananas for. What I DON'T have is the engineering background. I don't have the math background. I don't have the "intelligence" that NASA would require for me to have on PAPER to have even a chance at getting in.
Can you see my frustration? Can you see the thermometer on my head about to blow like an atomic bomb?
There are people in this world that have FANTASTIC skill sets, some skill sets that you can never teach to someone - they have to be acquired through self motivation. Yet the people that would fit in with the work that some companies (and government agencies) do can not make it in because they don't have the credentials on paper - the math and engineering skills.
I am not saying I want to go work for NASA. I already have a career lined up somewhere else after I graduate so I won't be investigating this opportunity, however difficult it would be for me, not having the "paper knowledge", to worm my way in in the first place. However, after speaking with this engineer I would fit in so well with that company. Yet, I am not speaking for myself - I am speaking for the thousands of students out there that are in the SAME BOAT I AM that can't step in to a fantastic career because of their lack of paper knowledge.
This is just such a mind boggling problem - America wants us to be higher educated. Companies are after the best of the best. They only want to look at the graduates in the top 10% of their programs for recruitment. Schools are telling students to push harder and achieve greater.
What about the common sense? What about the hands-on skills? What about the people skills? Who is going to teach these? How are students going to learn them and do well with them?
If these are the budding engineers going to work for NASA we in America have a problem. I hope none of them work on any projects involving sending people to the Moon or Mars, or anywhere else in space, or on Earth for that matter, because they don't have the brain capacity (its all filled with numbers and theory) to hold common sense, hands-on skills, and people skills.
posted by Steve at
7:49 PM
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