Antenna Work
I have been having some RFI and antenna issues at the house here. I have experimented with antennas for years. One thing to keep in mind is almost all of my antennas are or have been in the attic - outside antennas are mostly a no-no here.
The first attic antenna I ever used was a 40m dipole zig-zagged around the attic space next to my room (second floor, one wall opens to an attic space). This never did well.
I used a screwdriver antenna mounted to my truck with about 150' of cable running to it for many years - this worked and I worked the world on it, but hooking it up and disconnecting it every time I came home or went back out was a real pain. I still have this option, and I run a lot of mobile HF these days with my FT-857D.
At some point in the past 3-4 years I stuck a 40m dipole in the attic above my room (along the peak of the roof - the best place inside to put it, or as much of it I could fit there). This is a decent antenna. I have made a ton of QSO's on it. However, the antenna covers one band and 40m usually has a high noise level - s5-s9 depending on conditions.
In my quest for a multi-band antenna I took a small piece of wire, very thin (not as thin as magnet wire, this is copper and insulated. I can't remember where I got it or what it was from), and tossed it up over the roof and tied it off to a tree on the other side of the property (mind you, the tree is only 10' high). Then I used part of the gutter system of the house as a counterpoise and loaded it up with a tuner. This worked, but caused some RFI - especially on 20m. I could turn things on and off when keying up that I probably never even found!
So I put up a loop antenna last year. This wraps around the entire attic space above my room - it covers the whole house, as much as the attic covers. I would say it is 200-250' long. I fed this with ladder line and ran it to my tuner. This antenna works pretty well on all bands since it uses the tuner, but it causes RFI - I notice it on my TV on 20m. However, I was using this antenna one day and my neighbor came over and complained about RFI on his TV. So now a whole new can of worms has been opened.
I also put up a 6m ground plane. This little antenna works great when the band opens. I have worked Nevada, Florida, out East to Maine, and most of the South/South East (EM land). It doesn't work as well as a beam antenna, but considering my circumstances it works pretty well.
Then, after the RFI issue with my neighbor I found it happens on 10m for sure. I didn't try any other bands other than 6 and 10. I think I was on 6m when I had the initial complaint and was only working 6 and 10 that day. After a high-pass filter and an Amidon F240-K ferrite core the RFI on 6 was gone but 10 was still there. So I put a ground plane antenna up, resonant for 10 meters. I think I was still getting in to the TV but I checked that before I left for my trip, which was over 3 weeks ago now. I will have to re-visit that one.
So, after some consulting with a friend of mine, Steve, on the RFI issue he suggested I try to get resonant antennas up. Having a resonant antenna with low SWR will go a long way to helping out on the RFI issue. The loop that I was using on all bands was being forced to radiate on non-resonant frequencies - which could be a leading cause of the problem. The antenna works, ham radio speaking, but causes other problems. Being in a compromised situation (the attic space for antennas) really makes this hard - it would be much easier to put a resonant antenna up outside such as a vertical, a set of dipoles, a fan dipole, or the best would be beam antennas on a tower! However, considering where I am - that can't happen.
So the creativity starts. After hearing a few of the odd-ball setups Steve has done in the past (fan dipoles, a vertical grounded to the water heater and run up through the second floor of an apartment, tiny magnet wire strung up in trees with a fishing sinker, etc) I thought the one that would be the easiest to do is a fan radiator grounded to some duct work in the attic. I had my 40m dipole up in the attic so I originally was going to do the fan dipole idea, however that is twice as much work as a set of 1/4 wave radiators. You take half of a fan dipole and run that off the duct work as a counterpoise (1/4 wave radiators on all bands connected to a single feed point).The duct work goes back in the house to all kinds of things, so there is no shortage of a counterpoise. I figured this would do the trick for sure.
I got to work on this (about 4 weeks ago now). I used an SO-239 chassis with the 4 bolt holes. I cut in to the rafter brace for the duct work (which was screwed in to the duct in two places - good electrical connection) for the SO-239 to fit and drilled holes for two bolts. Then I soldered a loop to the center pin (maybe 1/2") so I had room to solder on all of my radiators. Then I started fanning them out and tacking them in place wherever I put them.
Well, it isn't that easy. Apparently there is a lot of interaction between the wires where I strung them up. I have been having a lot of issues trying to tune the mess. One change here affects everything else there.
I had Steve come over yesterday and take a look at everything to see if he could come up with some ideas. After a trip to the attic he said my radiators were too close and to fan them out more. So that will be the next step to my project. I will have to get up there when it is cool enough to work (at night). The attic sure does get HOT!
That sounds easy enough, right? Well I am sure I will run in to some more problems on this one! It really is a mess of an antenna, but if I can get it to work that would be a big relief.
Just for the heck of it, Steve wanted to take a walk around the house to see if there were any other odd-ball things to consider. Sure enough, he found one - part of the gutter system (separated from everything else on the back side) has a downspout that runs a few inches from a spigot. The spigot is connected to the rest of the plumbing (all copper!) in the house = fabulous ground. The gutter system would make a nice radiator, fed against the plumbing, on some frequency.
So I gave this a shot. I got out another SO-239, some wire, a strip of braided ground strap, and a hose clamp and connected everything together. This setup makes an excellent antenna on 20m! It has a flat SWR across the whole band. It even resonates with about a 1.5:1 SWR on 60m (3ord harmonic of 20m). The best part is I don't have any RFI on my TV (which does have a high-pass filter and Amidon F240-K in place). The drawback is it seems to be about 2 S-units weaker of an antenna than the fan spider webby thingy in the attic (run through the tuner). I didn't compare it to the loop. If the SWR is good its worth a shot though, right?
Another idea is to use the spigot as a ground for a few types of antennas - hamsticks, a buddistick, etc, etc. Or, even a fan setup on the outside wall (painted the same color as the house to cammo it!).
I just wish I didn't have to jump through so many hoops. It really is a lot of work, but if I can get this to work without RFI problems and being able to put out a respectable signal it will all be worth it.
The first attic antenna I ever used was a 40m dipole zig-zagged around the attic space next to my room (second floor, one wall opens to an attic space). This never did well.
I used a screwdriver antenna mounted to my truck with about 150' of cable running to it for many years - this worked and I worked the world on it, but hooking it up and disconnecting it every time I came home or went back out was a real pain. I still have this option, and I run a lot of mobile HF these days with my FT-857D.
At some point in the past 3-4 years I stuck a 40m dipole in the attic above my room (along the peak of the roof - the best place inside to put it, or as much of it I could fit there). This is a decent antenna. I have made a ton of QSO's on it. However, the antenna covers one band and 40m usually has a high noise level - s5-s9 depending on conditions.
In my quest for a multi-band antenna I took a small piece of wire, very thin (not as thin as magnet wire, this is copper and insulated. I can't remember where I got it or what it was from), and tossed it up over the roof and tied it off to a tree on the other side of the property (mind you, the tree is only 10' high). Then I used part of the gutter system of the house as a counterpoise and loaded it up with a tuner. This worked, but caused some RFI - especially on 20m. I could turn things on and off when keying up that I probably never even found!
So I put up a loop antenna last year. This wraps around the entire attic space above my room - it covers the whole house, as much as the attic covers. I would say it is 200-250' long. I fed this with ladder line and ran it to my tuner. This antenna works pretty well on all bands since it uses the tuner, but it causes RFI - I notice it on my TV on 20m. However, I was using this antenna one day and my neighbor came over and complained about RFI on his TV. So now a whole new can of worms has been opened.
I also put up a 6m ground plane. This little antenna works great when the band opens. I have worked Nevada, Florida, out East to Maine, and most of the South/South East (EM land). It doesn't work as well as a beam antenna, but considering my circumstances it works pretty well.
Then, after the RFI issue with my neighbor I found it happens on 10m for sure. I didn't try any other bands other than 6 and 10. I think I was on 6m when I had the initial complaint and was only working 6 and 10 that day. After a high-pass filter and an Amidon F240-K ferrite core the RFI on 6 was gone but 10 was still there. So I put a ground plane antenna up, resonant for 10 meters. I think I was still getting in to the TV but I checked that before I left for my trip, which was over 3 weeks ago now. I will have to re-visit that one.
So, after some consulting with a friend of mine, Steve, on the RFI issue he suggested I try to get resonant antennas up. Having a resonant antenna with low SWR will go a long way to helping out on the RFI issue. The loop that I was using on all bands was being forced to radiate on non-resonant frequencies - which could be a leading cause of the problem. The antenna works, ham radio speaking, but causes other problems. Being in a compromised situation (the attic space for antennas) really makes this hard - it would be much easier to put a resonant antenna up outside such as a vertical, a set of dipoles, a fan dipole, or the best would be beam antennas on a tower! However, considering where I am - that can't happen.
So the creativity starts. After hearing a few of the odd-ball setups Steve has done in the past (fan dipoles, a vertical grounded to the water heater and run up through the second floor of an apartment, tiny magnet wire strung up in trees with a fishing sinker, etc) I thought the one that would be the easiest to do is a fan radiator grounded to some duct work in the attic. I had my 40m dipole up in the attic so I originally was going to do the fan dipole idea, however that is twice as much work as a set of 1/4 wave radiators. You take half of a fan dipole and run that off the duct work as a counterpoise (1/4 wave radiators on all bands connected to a single feed point).The duct work goes back in the house to all kinds of things, so there is no shortage of a counterpoise. I figured this would do the trick for sure.
I got to work on this (about 4 weeks ago now). I used an SO-239 chassis with the 4 bolt holes. I cut in to the rafter brace for the duct work (which was screwed in to the duct in two places - good electrical connection) for the SO-239 to fit and drilled holes for two bolts. Then I soldered a loop to the center pin (maybe 1/2") so I had room to solder on all of my radiators. Then I started fanning them out and tacking them in place wherever I put them.
Well, it isn't that easy. Apparently there is a lot of interaction between the wires where I strung them up. I have been having a lot of issues trying to tune the mess. One change here affects everything else there.
I had Steve come over yesterday and take a look at everything to see if he could come up with some ideas. After a trip to the attic he said my radiators were too close and to fan them out more. So that will be the next step to my project. I will have to get up there when it is cool enough to work (at night). The attic sure does get HOT!
That sounds easy enough, right? Well I am sure I will run in to some more problems on this one! It really is a mess of an antenna, but if I can get it to work that would be a big relief.
Just for the heck of it, Steve wanted to take a walk around the house to see if there were any other odd-ball things to consider. Sure enough, he found one - part of the gutter system (separated from everything else on the back side) has a downspout that runs a few inches from a spigot. The spigot is connected to the rest of the plumbing (all copper!) in the house = fabulous ground. The gutter system would make a nice radiator, fed against the plumbing, on some frequency.
So I gave this a shot. I got out another SO-239, some wire, a strip of braided ground strap, and a hose clamp and connected everything together. This setup makes an excellent antenna on 20m! It has a flat SWR across the whole band. It even resonates with about a 1.5:1 SWR on 60m (3ord harmonic of 20m). The best part is I don't have any RFI on my TV (which does have a high-pass filter and Amidon F240-K in place). The drawback is it seems to be about 2 S-units weaker of an antenna than the fan spider webby thingy in the attic (run through the tuner). I didn't compare it to the loop. If the SWR is good its worth a shot though, right?
Another idea is to use the spigot as a ground for a few types of antennas - hamsticks, a buddistick, etc, etc. Or, even a fan setup on the outside wall (painted the same color as the house to cammo it!).
I just wish I didn't have to jump through so many hoops. It really is a lot of work, but if I can get this to work without RFI problems and being able to put out a respectable signal it will all be worth it.
1 Comments:
Hi Steve,
Been there, done that...and can feel the frustration. I live in a "historical district" (I call it a hysterical district) and have the same problems.
My neighbors don't have a clue (other than the Ham Radio liscense plate on the car) that I operate on the air from here.
It's not the "best solution" but one that has worked very well for me.
One of the reasons I operate "portable" equipment is ability to get away from all the electrical noise in the center of town.
Check my blog from the link on QRZ.com.
72's
John N8ZYA
Charleston, WV
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